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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4730
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Posted - 2014.06.10 12:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
Excellent. Another step towards the peaceful return of Caldari Prime to its rightful owners, another step towards better relationships between our two nations, another step towards the end of hostilities - another step towards peace.
Otro's legacy clearly lives on in Ishukone. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4734
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Posted - 2014.06.10 15:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Jurou Yuan wrote:This has zero effect on a capsuleer. You're not effected by this in the slightest, people. You're not part of the baseliners anymore.
Rise above this utter rubbish. You're right. I'm not a baseliner. Doesn't mean I can't also be a citizen and supporter of the Federation, and it certainly doesn't mean that I can't be happy that a planet of such deep cultural and historical significance to a people I deeply respect is being peacefully returned to them.
And yes, it does affect us, because as the Ida teaches, nothing exists in isolation. The state of Caldari Prime affects the state of Gallente-Caldari relations. The state of Gallente-Caldari relations affects the Empyrean War. The Empyrean War affects everything - from where combat pilots are or aren't to what they do or don't buy to what ships are or aren't valuable, expensive or rare to what resources are in demand. The Empyrean War comprises nearly 20,000 officially registered pilots and an inestimable number of unofficial supporters and operatives. It attracts pirates, scavengers, opportunists, mercenaries, patriots, demagogues. It acts as a training ground for the harsh territories of nullsec, and a dumping ground for those who tried and failed in those same outer reaches. ISK flows into, out of and through the fingers of every capsuleer involved in it.
The most insignificant action can have the greatest repercussions, and the largest things can have small beginnings.
There was a time when no-one knew who Verone or Istvaan Shogatsuu were. There was a time when no-one had heard of Tibus Heth. There was a time when the names "Band of Brothers" or "GoonSwarm" meant nothing to anyone. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4738
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Posted - 2014.06.10 17:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Calairis wrote:I see the media are still asking the tough questions about the Senate's takeaway from this agreement. I feel much safer with a press that keeps our elected officials accountable. Well done. Politically speaking, the Senate representatives involved are building themselves the mother of all re-election campaigns - "we ended the Second Gallente-Caldari War! We brought you peace and safety! We gave Caldari Prime back to the Caldari!" That sort of prestige is essentially a free vote from 90% of the Intaki population in their constituencies, a significant majority of the Gallentean and Jin-Mei votes, a pretty solid section of the Minmatar voter bloc and might even a few Mannar votes as well. It pretty much goes without saying that this will please Caldari citizens of the Federation immensely. It also dumps an immense amount of clout into their hands - you don't get flippant with the people who solved the largest and most costly threat to the Federation's security.
From a far more cynical perspective, handing over Arcurio - a huge city with a strong demographic Caldari majority, devastated by the Shiigeru impact - could easily be seen as a pragmatic way of giving a problem case to somebody else. Arcurio no doubt has deep cultural and historical significance to the State, but it's also kind of a mess right now - a mess that the Federation now no longer has to worry about spending as much money, time and personnel cleaning up.
Other factors include exchange of money, contacts, intelligence, resources, technology or other favours.
You're quite right. The Senate is getting something good out of this, and I, as with many others, would very much like to know what. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4739
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Posted - 2014.06.10 18:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
See, that puts a seed of worry into my mind. If the Federation is suddenly willing to sell what the State is buying, what if they're doing it because they anticipate a larger problem is at hand? Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4740
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Posted - 2014.06.10 18:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:I'm trying to imagine a problem large enough that the State and the Federation together couldn't solve it. Drawing a big of a blank. That's one of the many reasons why I advocate peace between the State and the Federation. Apart, we're already pretty damn spectacular. Working together, there's nothing we couldn't do. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4747
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Posted - 2014.06.11 06:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
TomHorn wrote:The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state. Behold Provist hypocricy.
The Federation meddling with internal State affairs? Unacceptable! The State meddling with internal Federation affairs? Perfectly fine. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4750
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Posted - 2014.06.11 20:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:NOT that I necessarily have a problem with this, but one could say that decrying State efforts to help minority populations find self-determination whilst the Federation reserves the right to do the exact same thing in the Empire is also hypocrisy. The Intaki people have a very significant difference to the Minmatar. We are not enslaved by the Federation, and joined it - co-founded it, in fact - as a matter of personal choice. The majority of the Intaki ethnicity and the majority of the Intaki system's populace desire to remain with the Federation.
More importantly, as a lot of Provists seem far too stupid to understand, even if the majority of Intaki did desire to leave the Federation, we'd still operate a democratic society that championed the causes of freedom and individualism, and we certainly wouldn't want their control of our interests replaced with the Caldari's. Provists do not desire Intaki freedom, as has been made very, very clear by Heth, the CPD and their capsuleer cheerleaders on the IGS - they desire to exchange vassalage to the Federation for vassalage to them. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4750
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Posted - 2014.06.11 20:38:00 -
[8] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Or perhaps nothing more than a trading agreement and mutual defence treaty? The State isn't exactly famous for it's expansionist policies, Andreus. We're also not famous for bullying allies to change their ways to match our own, or we might have had a few things to say on the subject of Slavery. I didn't say "the State," Pieter, I said "the Provists." It's well established that anyone who supports Heth does not and cannot support the State. Provists are traitors. Supporters of Heth are traitors. I wasn't accusing anyone you care about of hypocricy. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4753
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Posted - 2014.06.12 20:34:00 -
[9] - Quote
Likewise. What helps Ishukone helps us all. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4759
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Posted - 2014.06.20 23:26:00 -
[10] - Quote
You know, if I can be totally honest, I'm actually just drumming my fingers, waiting for the Caldari lunatic fringe to do a complete 180 and start accusing Heth and the CPD of being a Federal plot. Mane 614
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Andreus Ixiris
Duty. Circle-Of-Two
4759
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Posted - 2014.06.22 07:40:00 -
[11] - Quote
Do you consider yourself to be part of the Caldari lunatic fringe, Pieter? I don't. I actually think of you as representative of sensible, rational Caldari.
And you don't really have a fringe because you buzz-cut. Mane 614
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